(no subject)

[trinityvixen]

Really, you think? Stalemate, you say?

What worries me most about this goddamned format war piece of shit nonsense? It affects the next-gen console I would most want to own: the PlayStation 3. I could give a good goddamn what the XBOX 360 has, and the Wii will probably be in a non-DVD format so that doesn't even matter (friends of Nintendo, I predict you have another round of rebuying all your games--again--because Ninetendo doesn't believe in backwards compatibility; have fun with that, bitches!). Most of the movie studios have thrown in for Blu-Ray, and Sony is a powerhouse of electronics, so really, I shouldn't have to worry about it.

But Microsoft controls the PC industry. They just do, no matter what Apple wants (can?) to do about that, I think Microsoft isn't losing its control any time soon. When they have that much pull, they pull hard on everyone else. The PC gamers will definitely go for HD-DVD, then, as will other software providers, is my guess. People who want to record DVDs, say of home videos and the like, will still use regular DVDs until the HD ones drop in price, but when they do, they're going to want to use the format that best works with their computer. Since Microsoft will be on every 9 out of 10 computers, the manufacturers will have made them HD-DVD compatible. And, to watch them off of the computer (something "normal" people do, I'm told), they'll want the HD-DVD.

So, stalemate, yes. There are two routes: one, either HD-DVD or Blu-Ray dominates and the lesser format goes the way of the Beta and the Laser Disc, or, two, they are both dropped in favor of a compromise. The compromise could be a new format or dual-format computers/players/etc. But this won't come before the PS3 is launched, and it's already too late for the 360. Gamers are going to get screwed royally. If Sony loses, they can't play their HD-DVDs on the PS3. If Microsoft loses, the same is true with them of the Blu-Ray. If they compromise, both systems lose out on hi-def playing ability (unless they release new consoles, which will piss off everyone who got theirs early, I guarantee). Stupidity rules!

What's interesting to me is that Apple's been pretty quiet (far as I've heard) throughout this whole thing which makes me think that they, like everyone else, are hedging their bets. Unfortunately for the Mac Panthers out there, your "but it last a million years!" computer won't be able to play the HD-DVD/Blu-Ray discs, where as when my PC runs dead, I can get that upgrade. Then again, it's very possible the consumers will punish these electronics giants for being so fucking stupid about formatting issues that there won't be an agreed hi-def standard for DVD until your recent Mac purchasers need new ones. It's also possible that Apple's just a taaaaaad busy trying to get software to run better on their intel core duo machines to worry about this stuff.

Comments

[ecmyers.livejournal.com]

friends of Nintendo, I predict you have another round of rebuying all your games

Or I could just stick with my 8-bit NES :)

Also, as far as I know, there was never a format war over laserdisc. They never tried to compete with VHS or even DVD; it was always intended for serious film collectors, and until DVD came around, there was really no competition if you wanted a film in high-quality format in the original aspect ratio. You could either buy a pan-and-scan VHS for $20, or a widescreen laserdisc for $50. I'd like to see Blu-ray and HD-DVD handled the same way, honestly. No matter what they choose, DVD will be around for a good long while, more so if HD-DVD wins because that would require rebuying a lot more than a backwards compatible Blu-ray player.

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

I hate this push to hi-def in general. It's 9/10s scam, and the remaining 1/10th doesn't even matter unless you're one of a small percentage of people able to afford TVs and set ups that let you take advantage of it. But it's mostly a way to scare up money on every component that doesn't fly off shelves otherwise. I can believe how expensive the TVs are, but you start looking at the players, the components, the cable/satellite service? Holy Jeeze.

[cagexxx.livejournal.com]

To my knowledge, the Wii will be completely backwards compatible with Gamecube games, controllers, and memory cards. I believe the new Smash Brothers game is even designed to use only the Gamecube controller, but I could be wrong.

Don't get me started.

[teneda.livejournal.com]

When my dad got the plasma, he thought he was getting HD, just plug and play.

Nope. When we got it home and set up, we found you also needed HD service on your cable/satellite. THEN you need a DVD player and DVDs that USE HD. The final kick in the ass: The cables that go between the TV and your components have to be HD cables. Between 2 consoles, 2 DVD players, a VCR (Yes, he's old school) and the cable box, the cables came out to almost as much as he paid for the TV itself.

[droidguy1119.livejournal.com]

You do know that Nintendo is offering like 220 of their first party games for their old systems free for download with the system and I WAS under the impression that it also played GameCube games.

Those 220 games include all of the Mario and Zelda games, among other things. Here's the list: Even N64 DD games, madam.

And Blu-Ray is winning this war. Despite the whopping $600 price tag, people will buy the PS3 in droves and you just can't get it without the Blu-Ray player. Eventually, people will try it, it will catch on and the war is over. PS2, I think, was a huge factor in putting DVD at the top of the market, and so the same thing will happen here. The HD-DVD add-on for the XBOX is just that -- an add-on, and I think if it's not already included, few are going to spring for it.

[hslayer.livejournal.com]

Ah, the format war. You'd think Sony would've learned from Betamax, or MiniDisc, or UMD.... Too bad you might get boned, but you shouldn't be using your console for that crap anyway. (A little birdie told me your PS2 is your DVD player. For shame!)

Microsoft would happily have included support for both formats in Vista, but the other members of the HD consortium were not demanding royalties, while the BDA were. That would be royalties paid for EVERY COPY of Windows shipped. Bear in mind, however, DVD support is not included in Windows, either, but there's no shortage of software to add support.

Apple, for once, is probably hoping Bill Gates was right. He made a comment about the format war a few months ago, which was basically, "It doesn't matter, because we'll all be downloading all our movies soon, anyway." iTunes is Apple's new cash cow, they're loving a war that might axe both formats.

So get your PS3 for the GAMES it plays, and then if you must get BD movies, go ahead. Some of us have heaps of laserdiscs, and since we also have players, it's no problem for us.

I'll note also that most of the studios have thrown in for Blu-ray because its DRM is far, far nastier.

Gamers shouldn't worry about getting "screwed". They care about the games, not watching movies, and worst-case they have to wait until one format or the other becomes both dominant and affordable like the rest of the world. So sad....

Re: Don't get me started.

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

This is what I mean by rip-off. I still am not sure that you do need those cables. But the DVD player that's hi-def? That's complete bullshit, and your dad got taken. Now, if he asked for a HD-DVD/Blu-Ray player specifically, then that's fine. But if he wanted just to play his DVDs in good quality on a good quality hi-def TV? DVDs are already hi-def and besides progressive scan, there isn't anything to do a DVD player that already plays regular DVDs to make it "hi def." The one thing hi-def comes ready to do is play DVDs at hi-def with a DVD player. DVDs look awesome on our new TV, for example. VCR I don't think you can make hi-def; it just doesn't have enough lines going through the signal from the tape. Cable/satellite, however, you do need in hi-def to get hi-def delivery, though not enough channels offer it for me to care at this point.

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

....fuck.

They offer Pokemon Snap. Now I need a Wii. I was really ridiculously addicted to that game. It near killed me with the cute. I heard they were going to make another and I waited and waited, and nothing.

Damn it, I don't want a friggin' Nintendo! I just want to take pictures of Pokemon doing adorable things!!!!

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

Oh and as for the Sony-predicted win? Not certain of that still. The XBOX has the hook up on online games, and it's been the only next gen out there for a while, giving plenty of people pre-exposure to both it, what it offers, and HD-DVD in general. The XBOX started to kick some butt in the console wars, so I won't count it out yet.

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

God, the studios like their DRM, don't they? Even though almost every case of obnoxious DRM that goes out on the market either hideously backfires or else ends up in a lawsuit?

I don't think I'm ready for downloaded movies. I like hard copies too much. And I'm already sick of fucking iTunes. The idea of limiting how much I can burn a set of songs I paid for? Even if it's just for me? I buy less from them as a result. I move files around too much to be restricted to one program, a set number of moves or burns or shit like that. It's a major pain in the ass to go "Oops, can't burn these LEGALLY PURCHASED FILES anymore. Gotta take one of my burns (hope I still have it!) re-rip it and start all over." I still buy CDs, and I think most people will still buy DVDs.

And there's nothing wrong with using the PS2 for the DVD player. Fewer wires, less hassle.

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

Huh. Well, took them long enough to learn how to be kind to their customers, didn't it?

Re: Don't get me started.

[teneda.livejournal.com]

Which is why I was glad to be home when he said that. He thought that because the picture looked normal from the DVD player, he needed a new one. I told him, "Just get the cables, it'll be ok." The whole reason we got 2 DVD players is because one is region free, so he can watch his HK stuff. But cables for all those components. Sheeeeit.

And the industry explains it by saying, "You don't NEED HD." No shit, but what happens when everything goes HD? What if you're that poor shlub with a 19' color TV from 1980-something that still uses knobs?

[chuckro.livejournal.com]

Umm...Every Game Boy thus far has been at least one generation backwards-compatible. The GBA played both original game boy and game boy color games, and supported the Super Game Boy extra features. The DS plays GBA games. Which I like, because even though I own every generation of game boy, I only have to take one system with me when I travel.

Re: Don't get me started.

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

Oh yeah, the cables are fucking expensive. You can go online and get them cheaper, though. Monster has pretty much dominated the retail market, but you dont have to pay the $200 for one of theirs if you look online, so I'm told.

The industry is already going HD. Not only are they going HD, they're going flat-screen. No more CRTs pretty soon, not that the drop in plasma screen prices are anywhere near what they should be for that to be anything but a criminal move, but that's a rant for another day...

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

Not their platforms though. NES, SNES, yes, but N64? GameCube? Sorry if I'm biased (never had NESes of any stripe), but they really fell down on the later ones. Now, if you can download games to the Wii, more power to them. It doesn't change the years and years of "BUY NEW VERSIONS" policy they had.

Never having had a game boy (I had a Game Gear, though), I was only vaguely aware of their intercompatibility, which is a fine concession given the rest of Nintendo's practices. I guess I just appreciate Sony making its debut console compatible with the upgraded ones, and they are lucky they don't have a history of older consoles that weren't so accomodating, is all.

[hslayer.livejournal.com]

Well Billy G wants you to be able to download once (and preferably not from iTunes) and then stream to all your devices. The only time you'd need to copy would be for portable devices, and even those wouldn't require burning. I've been trying to build such a setup myself; I just haven't had the cash for all the hardware I need.
It might not happen, but we can already get movies on demand from our cable company and downloads keep increasing while CD sales keep declining...

I just can't help recalling how one of my issues with DVD when it came out was that it wasn't natively compatible with HDTV...hm. Can't say I told you so, but I told SOMEBODY. (darkling1, you here? I told YOU so!)

And, um, I'm just going to pretend I didn't see that last part. Gives me the jibblies...

[cagexxx.livejournal.com]

Hi again! I'm going to argue with you a bit, if you don't mind.

I think you're being unfair to Nintendo--Nintendo is the only one of the Big Three console makers who I think hasn't specifically done anything really shady. The Wii can be backwards compatible easily enough because the technology is so similar to the Gamecube's, but adding backwards compatibility to the SNES, N64, or Gamecube would have driven the price of the consoles up by a lot, and they decided to keep the prices down instead. Look at the Gamecube's $200 starting price point, and I think you might agree that Nintendo made a tough but effective decision, not something to be angry about. Nintendo these days has shown startlingly innovative thinking and is the only one of the Big Three with an unquestionably bright future.

And I don't like DRM either, but I don't think your specific complaint about iTunes is well-founded. As far as I'm aware, you're only allowed to burn a certain *playlist* between three and ten times (I don't remember), and then you can just change your playlist around. By the time you've exceeded that limit on a particular playlist, I think it's extraordinarily likely that you're doing something illegal, and if you're not, you can still get around it. It seems to me that Apple was pretty generous with that limitation, which I think used to be much more restrictive. If anything, I would complain (and do complain, but not much, since I don't buy DRM music) about the lack of interoperability between Apple's and competitors' formats and about the DMCA disallowing people from breaking DRM for otherwise-legal purposes.

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

Heh, I counter your jibblies with jubblies! (http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=158).

Do I have a point? No, but I can link to stuff too!

[trinityvixen.livejournal.com]

I am harsh on Nintendo, I realize, as they aren't wholy to blame for their lack of backwards comptability. Their systems have been around long enough for formats to change so radically that backwards compatibility wasn't even really possible, and the downloading with the Wii ought to amend this, so I will be less hostile. I never wasted any money on their crap systems anyway (still can't name more than a handful of must-play games for Nintendo, and the ones I can name all have to do with cute, cute fluffy animals).

I dunno, my sister's had some trouble burning her iTunes stuff more than a handful of times. And I had difficulty burning a playlist of songs that weren't all from the same album--aren't I supposed to be able to do that? It picked and chose which of my songs it would deign to record, and it didn't explain why it didn't like some of the songs (which might have allowed me to fix it). Really, I just plain don't like iTunes and only use it to put songs onto my iPod.

And I hate not being able to rip with iTunes and use the files with other programs. Because iTunes is ridiculously easy to rip CDs with, but I hate using it to play songs and I want my songs to be playable on Winamp or anything else I choose. So, I did the whole iTunes rip, now I'm gonna go back and re-rip using another program that won't prevent inter-program operation of my mp3s. I just now have to watch for sound quality, as I've found that mp3s at 128mbps don't sound as good as the Apple-format AACs at the same (I'm thinking I'll bump it up to 192), but then again, that could all be in my head (but if I've noticed poorer quality, then has to be because i'm not exactly fussy about this or have an ear for it).

[droidguy1119.livejournal.com]

The XBOX360 doesn't yet have HD-DVD capability. It will be a drive that connects to the system, so if XBOX users decide they want it -- and I don't think many of them will -- then they have to drop probably well over $100 or so to get the drive later (Microsoft hasn't yet announced a price).

And I wasn't saying that Sony would win the war, just Blu-Ray would defeat HD-DVD as HD-DVD holds less space than Blu-Ray and will also have fewer supporters.

[droidguy1119.livejournal.com]

In case you just meant that HD-DVD is out there period, there were a lot of issues with the players (not that there haven't been Blu-Ray issues, but still), and not a lot of people are rushing out to pick up $1000+ players that might not work. I think for the most part both formats are being ignored at the moment, but Blu-Ray being in the PS3, to me, seems like pretty much the winning card on the table. You want exposure? PS2s are everywhere, when the PS3 debuts, and like four times so when the price drops (I understand Sony is just trying to get a handle on a specific chip that would combine everything in a way that would make the hardware drop by like $200+), then there will be a PS3 in millions of homes, and that translates to millions of Blu-Ray DVD player owners.

[slackwench.livejournal.com]

Why would I not be able to change the optical drive on my Mac? Or add an external reader?

Apple doesn't care which format people use. It's in their best interest if there's a standard, but they're not on either committee, so there's no reason for them to push one over the other.

[cagexxx.livejournal.com]

I suppose you're being fair if iTunes gave you those problems. They may be better now because of a lot of complaints, though. Apple has this weird combination of wanting to be as fair as possible to the customer while staying as unfair as possible to the competition.

When ripping a CD, for the best quality, you should use the Lame encoder, which is pretty much undisputed as the best MP3 encoder ever. Any ripper that comes with (or supports as an add-on) the Lame encoder should be good, and you should set the quality to high, and greater than 128 kbps if you want.

However, I have no experience using a ripper that also encodes--I always rip to wave files and manually encode from there, and of course I have no fear of the command prompt. I think the most recommended ripper is EAC, Exact Audio Copy, although I used Audiograbber years ago. I'll be happy to help you if you want to be as much of a perfectionist as I am.

[hslayer.livejournal.com]

My main recommendation is to try to assume an air of detachment. Trying to predict what'll happen is likely to be about as accurate as trying to predict the weather exactly three months from now. Just sit back and watch...their antics are likely to be funnier than most movies you could get on any format.

Speaking of which, if native Windows support for HD doesn't kill Blu-Ray, the ad I just saw might: "RV, now available on DVD and Blu-Ray!" Oh, Robin, what have ye wrought?!

[hslayer.livejournal.com]

Also, since we're linking, please read this before deciding you want Blu-Ray just because you plan to buy a PS3 anyway. From the consumer's perspective, especially where DRM is concerned, Blu-Ray is way worse. And potentially, depending on just how long ago that shiny new tv you got was first bought, it's possible NEITHER will actually PLAY hi-def for it due to HDCP. Make sure that tv supports it before you even decide to care.

[umeyard.livejournal.com]

Just because i can....

I will tell you how the PS3 is next month :)

oh wait...thats right its not out yet.....*grins*
still
will let you know after I get back from CA since i get to play on a prototype while out there....*grins*

Its good to be the king.

[hslayer.livejournal.com]

Actually, they are. I don't usually keep up on Apple news, but looking now, I find that they joined the BDA last year.